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Kevin R. Free, the artistic director of Mile Square Theater, shares his journey from actor to director and audiobook narrator. He discusses the difference between directing and acting, emphasizing the importance of collaboration and embracing failure as part of the creative process. Kevin also talks about his casting criteria and the need for actors to be authentic and human in the industry. He shares insights into regional productions and the challenges of set design. Finally, Kevin offers advice for early career actors, encouraging them to become part of a community and be open to opportunities. In this conversation, Kevin R Free and James Larson discuss the journey to building a career in the entertainment industry. They emphasize the importance of being proactive and putting oneself out there to create opportunities. They also highlight the need to be your own agent and take charge of your career. The conversation explores the rewards of hard work and the enjoyment of being in the trenches. They delve into the world of voiceover work and provide tips for getting started. Additionally, they discuss the importance of having outside interests and hobbies, with a focus on cooking as a creative outlet.
Takeaways
Embrace failure as part of the creative process and learn from it.
Create a collaborative and fun rehearsal environment as a director.
Be authentic and human in the industry, both as an actor and a director.
Build relationships and become part of a community to expand opportunities.
Consider opportunities that may not pay initially, as they can lead to future collaborations and growth.
Chapters
00:00 Introduction and Kevin’s Journey
04:19 Kevin’s Main Focus: Directing and Audiobooks
08:59 The Difference Between Directing and Acting
09:50 Taking Responsibility as a Director
10:57 Embracing Failure as Part of the Process
12:46 Casting and Collaborating with Actors
15:51 Criteria for Auditioning Actors
17:20 Creating a Fun and Collaborative Rehearsal Environment
18:37 The Play That Goes Wrong and Toxic Theater Culture
20:22 Being Authentic and Human in the Industry
21:19 Regional Productions and Set Design
25:06 Becoming Artistic Director of Mile Square Theater
27:10 Programming and Focus of Mile Square Theater
32:26 Advice for Early Career Actors
46:39 The Journey to Building a Career
48:07 Being Your Own Agent
49:16 The Rewards of Hard Work
50:14 Balancing the Business and Art of Acting
53:31 Getting Involved in Voiceover Work
56:02 Tips for Getting into Voiceover Work
59:25 Having Outside Interests and Hobbies
01:01:15 Cooking as a Creative Outlet
James Larson (00:00.142)
Hey everyone and welcome to the actorzilla podcast. I’m your host James Larson and today we have on Kevin R. Furee. Kevin is the artistic director of Mile Square Theater and he’s also a multi hyphenate artist, a producer, a director, an actor, a writer, an audio book narrator. Did I leave anything out or is there more to that?
Kevin R Free (00:29.985)
Um, I mean, he didn’t call me a punk. Yeah. That, but that’s…
James Larson (00:33.934)
That might be at the end, that might come, yeah. That’ll be added by the end for sure.
Kevin R Free (00:44.43)
All those hyphens, maybe just underachiever would be the most correct.
James Larson (00:47.387)
Yeah, what an underachiever. I’m on your Yeah Clearly you’re not busy enough. You know you need more to do
Kevin R Free (00:56.989)
Yeah, I got an email from somebody a few months ago saying, asking me what my problem was. I needed to sit down somewhere. I needed to just sit down.
James Larson (01:07.566)
You need to sit down. Oh my, that’s so funny. So I’m kind of curious with all those titles, I’d love to hear a bit about your journey. I think on your website you said that you started as an actor.
Kevin R Free (01:19.501)
Yeah, yeah, an actor-singer. I’d always wanted to do a Broadway musical. When I was growing up, that was what I, I moved to New York to be a musical comedy star. That was like what I thought was the thing. And when that, when I didn’t book a Broadway show, and I guess I’m not, I’m not ruling out it.
ruling it out as a possibility now, but it’s also something that I’m less interested in as far as the grind is concerned of eight shows a week, my 55, almost 35 year old body. But I always wanted to do a Broadway musical and when that didn’t seem to be happening, I just started saying yes to all the other jobs that people would offer me. I think looking back on
on all of the work that I did that has brought me to here. What I think people were seeing in me when they were offering me other kinds of work was that I’m a leader. And that is, I think that is the superpower, is that I am good at setting people at ease when the sky feels like it’s falling and making decisions.
about, you know, the emergency decisions that come from producing theater and whatnot that don’t feel like actual emergencies because nobody’s, you know, going to the hospital. But I’m good at making those decisions. And then I’m also good at making decisions that put humanity first, that put people first, which of course is where we are in history, I think.
in the theater game, which is great. So I think that people just, so people offered me things. Hey, do you wanna do a reading? Do you wanna direct a reading? Do you want to teach these young people? And then from doing that, the big people thought, oh, he knows what he’s doing, so let’s give him leadership positions. So then I became an education director and then really started.
Kevin R Free (03:46.377)
directing things, but not really saying that I was a director. And it was around 2017 when I said out loud that I was a director, that my directing career took off in the way that I wished that my acting career had taken off all those years ago. And I think that is because the universe knew that I was meant to be a leader. And so when I said I wanted to be a director, then all of a sudden all this work came to me.
And here I am, 55, actually pursuing a career as a director. Yeah.
James Larson (04:19.19)
That’s amazing. So you think director is like your main, is that like, you know, you’re multi hyphenate, but is director leading the charge for you right now?
Kevin R Free (04:25.618)
Yeah, I think it’s… Yeah. I mean, you know, I love audiobooks. The audiobooks, I get to scratch the acting itch, and I get to play all the characters. So that part appeals to both my ego and just like the actor itch. So I think it’s directing and audiobooks are my…
are the things that are leading the charge, to use your parlance. I, yeah, I love being a director in a way that I never loved being an actor. Yeah, what about it? Well, first, as a director, I’m not afraid of collaboration. I’m not afraid of listening to other people’s ideas. I’m not afraid of…
James Larson (05:02.551)
What about it?
Kevin R Free (05:18.549)
being voted down. I’m not afraid of disagreement. I’m not afraid, you know, when people say, oh, you know what, I think this is a better idea for this moment, you know. I don’t have any ego about any of that and that feels really nice. I don’t.
Kevin R Free (05:39.333)
As an actor, and you know this, as an actor, there’s so much insecurity. You know, I did a wrong thing in rehearsal and I said the wrong thing in rehearsal so they’ll never hire me again. And then you’re not in the moment anymore and then that ruins all of your work. And then you get to tech rehearsal and you forget the tech rehearsals isn’t about you. It’s about the director and the director’s creative team making decisions to make you look good.
but you still as an actor feel very like, why are they paying attention to me? Did I do something wrong? Is it terrible? I mean, this is all just, you know, it’s par for the course for actors. And I love actors and I, as a director, remind them all the time, I know that you are creating complex emotion all the time. I know it and I understand it. And I know that when I give you an adjustment, it feels personal.
because your body doesn’t know the difference between something that you’ve made up and what is true to you. Even if it’s real, I totally understand that. And I, as an actor, know it and hate it. I hate it. I just hate the insecurity that comes from being an actor and that’s…
James Larson (06:54.86)
Right.
Kevin R Free (07:03.017)
that’s separate from auditions. I mean, I loved auditioning. Auditions are fun for me. Oh my gosh. Yeah, I get to do a whole show for somebody in a room. Like that, that part is really great. I’m so good at looking at a script and they give me a thing. I’m great at making choices and just like going for it. Like, I love that. I love that. And I also, as an actor, never had any doubt that I would have a career. I was never…
James Larson (07:08.042)
You did? Really?
James Larson (07:21.163)
Right.
Kevin R Free (07:31.229)
I mean, I think that’s divine. I think God, the universe, gave me that. I just never was like, oh, yes, I’ve been waiting tables for six months, but I’m going to have a job. It’s going to be right on the corner. I never had any doubt that I would work. But when I started working, it was, did I make the right choice in that scene? I don’t know. I think my voice sounded funny in that moment. My accent is inconsistent. I’m the worst. It was so easy to put myself down as an actor.
really unfair to myself. But as a director, I have ideas, I express those ideas, I try to see if they’ll work, and sometimes they do. And I like looking at other humans and saying, so here’s what I think this moment is about. How can we make that happen? I like calling a playwright of a new play, here’s the feeling that I got when I read the play.
James Larson (08:25.496)
Right.
Kevin R Free (08:32.489)
Here’s what I saw when I read it. Let’s try to visualize what the scenic design would look like. I’m totally into that. I love it, and I don’t ever, even if people disagree with me, I don’t ever feel terrible about the disagreements. And I also never get tired of taking responsibility. Not afraid to do that, you know?
James Larson (08:59.658)
What do you mean by taking responsibility? Yeah.
Kevin R Free (09:02.005)
You know, if I make a mistake, if I make a mistake for something, if I, about something, you know, I don’t need to be right in the same way. And I don’t need to pass the buck in the same way. I’m ready. I’m okay. You know, even as an artistic director running a whole organization, if something, something goes wrong, I’m happy to be the person to say, I, yeah, that’s my fault. I failed. Um, um.
even if I feel terrible about my failure. I’m just really, as a director, I’m much better, as a leader, I’m much better at accepting failure as a part of the process and not as the end of the process.
James Larson (09:50.958)
I love that. Failure is a part of the process. I’m writing it down. That’s how important I thought that was. Failure is a part of the process.
Kevin R Free (09:55.238)
Yeah. Oh, great. Thank you.
Kevin R Free (10:00.413)
not the end of a process. Yeah.
James Larson (10:01.39)
the end. Yeah, I love that. I kind of I have the same the same kind of philosophy, I guess, too, that failure is not what is that failure is not fatal or whatever that quote is. And I think it’s so important in the creative arts, because it’s like, to me, that’s fun. That’s the fun of it. That’s the fun of the work, especially because I think I think as an actor, the best part is the rehearsal process because you’re discovering
Kevin R Free (10:15.541)
Oh yeah, sure, sure.
James Larson (10:29.978)
you’re connecting with people, you’re maybe you meet new actors, and you get to be in the thick of it. And I think that’s the fun part. And I think you can’t go into that process being like, I know, I know how everything is going to happen. I know how everything’s going to work. Like, that’s not art, you know, I mean, art is like getting in the thick of it and disagreeing and, and being okay with that. And obviously, it depends on the room. And I’m sure you’ve been in a lot of
different rehearsal rooms and there’s different vibes on each, you know, with each rehearsal process. With each, you know, depending on who you have in the room. Do you have like, obviously, you are involved in casting all these shows, like, do you look do you look for particular things and actors when you’re auditioning people?
Kevin R Free (11:23.689)
Yes, it’s different for different.
organizations or processes. I mean, I have a strict, no asshole policy. I don’t know if I’m allowed to say that on your podcast. I don’t, you know, I…
James Larson (11:38.146)
Sure.
Kevin R Free (11:47.585)
I like to find out from people what the people that I love, how they are in rehearsal and how they are in a room. Are they good collaborators? Are they people who only think about themselves? You know, and I ask those questions. I like to engage people in conversation when they come in to audition because I wanna know, are they, for lack of a better expression, robots?
James Larson (12:09.036)
Right.
Kevin R Free (12:17.885)
I used to tell students, you’re not a robot. Don’t come in and just like, my name is da, and I’m gonna do a monologue from ba, ba. Come in with an open heart and look at, look around the room. And like, if you like the shirt that somebody is wearing, say it, if you like a picture that’s on the wall, say it. If you just, you know, be yourself when you come in, because ultimately you’re gonna spend more time as yourself in the room with the director than you are as the character.
when you’re there. So like if you come in the room and you’re just like fun, then the director might wanna spend time with you for seven hours a day, like, you know? And so there is something to be said for.
James Larson (12:54.527)
Right.
Kevin R Free (13:02.785)
for personality, for humanity when people come in.
Kevin R Free (13:09.829)
I like to, and what that is for me is also leaving room for catharsis, because in processes now there are people, you know, I try to do a consent-based practice so that we’re talking from the first day about consent and where one can be touched and that kind of thing. And so I want to make sure that the…
people who are coming in the room, not only made theater 100 years ago in 2019, but have made theater post 2020, and are on board with some of the positive changes that have happened in the American theater. So there’s that, I like to engage in conversation just to find out about that kind of stuff. And then, I don’t care about social media and the number of followers that people have.
But if I’m doing an independent theater project or I’m doing something at my theater, excuse me, my small theater in Hoboken, New Jersey, I like to see if you have a social media presence. I wanna know, are you at least posting pictures of your castmates? I don’t need you to promote the show in the same way that our job is to promote the show, but I would like to be able to…
cast people who are, who would be talking about doing a show. I don’t do a lot of posting on social media either, but I do post about the work that I’m doing. And for me, it’s less about promoting the show and more about putting the name of the theater or the name of the play out in the world. So even if you don’t post all through rehearsal and what not.
James Larson (14:42.167)
Hmm. Yeah.
Kevin R Free (15:05.717)
that you post when it closes. I just did this amazing play, this is what it was, it was at Miles Square Theater, you know. Like I just wanna see what your social media presence is like. What else do I look for? I mean, clearly I look for good actors, but that is also so subjective that I am less concerned about making a good play. I think I’m a good, I cast well. So I’m less concerned about
you know, is this play gonna be good? And more about, is this play gonna mean something to all of us by the end of it? Is it gonna be a thing that we wish would never end? Is it gonna be a thing that, or is it gonna be a thing that we wish had ended after the first day? Hey. Is that matching the personalities in the room?
James Larson (15:51.919)
Is that about is that about like matching the personalities in the room or just? Matching the person to the part if that makes sense
Kevin R Free (15:59.473)
Um, yeah, I mean, it’s both. It’s both. Um, you know, I just directed The Play That Goes Wrong up at Portland Stage. And it was really important to us to have people who could not only do the physical comedy, who could do comedy at all, um, but it was also people, about people who were game to figure out how to do this play.
not off Broadway or on Broadway, but you know using…
consent and intimacy practices for now and who would be willing and able to have a good time in that room. Like it’s a really funny play and as we rehearsed we made each other laugh so much and it was important to me. You know I work a lot with people who are who or I have worked a lot with people who are.
Kevin R Free (17:05.985)
only about work at all times. There’s never a moment where they stop and tell a story. There’s never a moment where they’re part of a group thing. Like, there’s never a moment. And I think that feels like…
The hardest part about work, when you’re not allowed, you don’t allow yourself to have any humor while you’re working, to me, it just feels wrong. It doesn’t feel like a world that I wanna be in. It’s not a world I wanna lead. I want us to do the work. I want us to have a good time while we’re doing the work. And…
our production of The Play That Goes Wrong is really, it’s my favorite thing that I’ve directed in a really long time. I feel like we made something really funny and really good and, and The Play That Goes Wrong is about, is about that thing that we all learned when we were learning to make theater and that is that the show must go on. And somewhere along the line, the show must go on became very toxic, right? So like we’re,
We’re missing our, we’re missing funerals and we’re missing weddings and we’re missing milestones in our children’s lives because the show must go on. We’re singing while we’re sick and hurting our voices. Like we’re doing all of these things that we really just shouldn’t do. If you’re in any other business, you get that time off. Right, it just, you know, so the play that goes wrong is about that thing that has become toxic in our community. And that is that the.
James Larson (18:37.067)
Right.
Kevin R Free (18:45.013)
play, the show must go on at all costs. But the beauty of the play that goes wrong, the other side of it is about that moment that we realized, oh my gosh, this is what I wanna do with my life. This is that conversation between audience and performer that feels like, that we usually get bitten by that bug, by that feeling of…
Oh my gosh, I did something that made people laugh. And also, oh my gosh, I did an entire thing and everything went wrong, but it was still really wonderful. Look at how great it was. And I… And here we were in 2024 making this play, knowing that if somebody got hurt, we would stop. That if somebody got sick, we wouldn’t do a show. That if somebody had a funeral to go to, we wouldn’t do a show.
We knew all of this going in. We also knew that we were good at our jobs. And so we weren’t worried so much about, is the play going to be good? We were just really worried about moment to moment making the play. So I feel like…
Yeah, I’m looking for collaborators who are willing and who are not afraid to be human with other collaborators, who are not afraid to be vulnerable. That’s the tea, James. That’s the tea.
James Larson (20:22.478)
I love that. I always tell people that, you know, it’s not about being on all the time. Like, I don’t know if you know those kind of people in this industry that, you know what I mean? They’re always performing for other people. And when it’s, and they’re not on stage, I’m like, just be a person, just, you know, how are you doing? And I’ve always been that kind of person in the industry. And I value that in other people too. I think, and I, I think it’s more accepted now too, I guess, to, to be yourself, maybe.
Kevin R Free (20:47.355)
Um.
Kevin R Free (20:51.409)
Yeah. Well, I want to say, I just wanted to say that I might be one of those people who’s always on.
James Larson (20:58.878)
I don’t I don’t think so. I think you seem you seem down to earth and cool to me, but We’ll find out by the end. No We’ll find out yeah
Kevin R Free (21:03.525)
I think maybe that’s…
Kevin R Free (21:10.933)
Definitely. And please let me know your assessment.
James Larson (21:14.317)
Yeah, I will.
James Larson (21:19.486)
I love that play too. I’m kind of curious, like what do they do for regional productions? Because the set was a huge part of the Broadway production. So like does regional theater have that set or no?
Kevin R Free (21:31.517)
Yeah, yeah, we had, I mean, you know, it was designed. In our production at Portland Stage, it was designed by the artistic director, who is a scenic designer, Anita Stewart. And we started with a document where she created an Excel document that just said, here are the tricks that work with the set. And then we decided which ones we were going to do.
as we rehearsed. And there were things that we knew that we couldn’t do. Like at the end of the play, the character of Jonathan enters through that door on the upper level and grabs onto a lighting trust that has come down and then he swings around to the door. And she said, we’re not gonna do that. That’s not a thing we’re gonna do. And I was like, okay, great. So, and then as they were building the set, we had regular meetings with the technical director and…
the associate technical director about how they were building things and we were explaining to them, this is how we think it works. We also had this really great movement coordinator who had been a clown, who had been a mime and a clown for years, who said, here’s how we can accomplish some of these tricks. And so we, yeah, I mean, the walls fall down and everything. So it’s…
Some days the walls don’t fall. There have been a couple of performances where the walls did not fall. That was sort of, you know, and every time something like that fails, like we have to have a conversation with the actors. Like, what, they ask, well, what do we do if that happens again? Like, what if we, like, how do we, what do we do? What do we do? And I said, okay, here’s what we do. Yeah.
James Larson (23:00.438)
I mean, it is called the play that goes wrong, right?
Ha ha
Kevin R Free (23:27.453)
You know, I kind of felt as though with this whole process, it was nice because I didn’t feel like the actors had any problems asking for leadership and asking questions like what, how, do. We want this to be safe, so if the wall looks like it’s not gonna fall, is it going to fall? Like if it falls late, was it ever gonna fall late?
And, you know, so we had to make a decision about making sure that if it didn’t fall when it was supposed to fall, that they were locked in place so that there was no chance of them falling at a different time, you know? So yeah, we did the whole set. We did the whole thing. And then decided from there what worked and what didn’t. And the script tells you when you’re allowed to improvise some things.
And because of that, there are other things that are improvised in our production that are not the same every day. And then there are other moments where in the improvisation that happened during rehearsal, it has now become that thing every performance. Because the actors in this production are so professional and so accomplished and so smart. Like it just really, I…
don’t have any bad things to say about this process of actually going back to Maine to see it on Sunday, to see the closing performance. Okay. Yeah. This is your time. You have to go through certain techniques that are pretty quick to direct. Okay. So, I’m going to go ahead and start with the first one.
James Larson (25:06.822)
Oh, cool. Is this your, are you drawn to a certain type of project to direct or is it, or do you have another process?
Kevin R Free (25:17.173)
Yeah, yes, I’m drawn to them, but I, they offered it to me and I was surprised. I was surprised because I like the play and it just sort of, you know, I’m a black queer director who does a lot of black queer work, black and or queer work. Like, so like, to be, to be invited to direct the play that goes wrong was like, oh, wait, me? Me? Oh, okay.
James Larson (25:43.574)
Had you worked there before as a director? Oh, okay.
Kevin R Free (25:45.482)
Oh yeah, this is my, I think this is my sixth play there. I’ve worked there every year since 2017, with the exception of 2020.
James Larson (25:48.98)
Oh wow.
Kevin R Free (25:59.305)
Yeah.
James Larson (26:00.614)
awesome. I love Portland, Maine, but I do have to say I’m from Portland, Oregon. So I don’t know if there’s beef between the Portlands. I know like Portland, Maine was first, obviously, but you know, Portland, Maine is beautiful though.
Kevin R Free (26:05.391)
Oh.
Kevin R Free (26:16.234)
Yeah. I think there is beef, and the beef is when you’re in Portland, Maine, and you, sometimes Google doesn’t know you’re in Portland, Maine, so like it gives you search results from Portland, Oregon. So, I mean, I think the beef is between Google and the people of Portland, Maine.
James Larson (26:32.32)
Right.
James Larson (26:37.006)
Google. Oh, I heard a story where a woman thought she was got on a plane and thought she was going to Oregon. And she went to Portland, Maine. She had no idea until she got there. That’s probably a Google. I’m gonna blame Google for that one, too. Yeah.
Kevin R Free (26:53.193)
Let’s blame Google. Why not? Why not? Google, we’re going to get you. This is the truth telling the Google truth telling podcast.
James Larson (26:57.134)
we’re gonna get you in this podcast.
James Larson (27:05.126)
Yeah, Google’s not gonna rank this episode now because any talking smack about Google, I’m sure it’s delisted. It’s not gonna work. So what brought you to Mile Square Theater?
Kevin R Free (27:10.869)
This is not gonna work. Oh boy.
Kevin R Free (27:21.473)
Yeah. In 2019, I directed a production of Pipeline there. Had a lovely experience doing that. And then they invited me back to direct in 2020. I directed a film version of the radio play. It’s a Wonderful Life. Wonderful Life. Not life. It’s Wonderful Life. That’s the sequel right there. Yeah, that’s it.
James Larson (27:45.559)
That’s a sequel, yeah.
Kevin R Free (27:50.277)
And, um, uh.
Kevin R Free (27:57.043)
I… So during the pandemic…
for about a year and a half, actually, starting in June of, right after George Floyd was murdered, I started hosting, or not hosting, producing, an online variety show called The Reparation Show. And it was an online variety show, then there was a different host every week, unified by the same kind of graphics that we had every week, and then I would do a segment called This Week in Reparations.
And in my little segment, I thanked the host for being on the show. And then I talked about anything, whatever, it didn’t matter. But on one episode in late 20.
Kevin R Free (28:46.549)
late 2020 or early 2021, I had the founder of Miles Square Theatre on the show, Chris O’Connor, and asked him about a number of things. And he mentioned in our conversation that they now had a succession plan because he was planning to step down and they thought that it would be time for the organization to be led by a person of color.
And he’d sort of made a joke, like, you know, maybe hint, that somebody I know might want to apply for that job. Huh huh huh. And then when they posted the job, he texted me and said, we posted this job. I don’t know if you’re interested in applying. So I did apply. And then I got the job. So that’s what brought me there. You know, we’re a small outfit. And I want us to be focusing on
new and gently used plays. And I want us to, I want playwrights to feel like we’re a place for them to try out new stuff. And we’re right across the river, right in Hoboken, which is so close to the city. And, you know, we don’t focus on bringing people from the city to see the shows.
James Larson (30:08.011)
Right.
Kevin R Free (30:14.793)
but we do, because we don’t think that, we don’t think that a lot of people are doing that. Excuse me one second. What’s up? I’m sorry, I have your mic. Oh, okay, that’s fine. Just close the door. Thank you. This is my husband. He’s going to be making a smoothie, and he was afraid it was gonna be a bad thing. You can hear the blender now. Sorry. Actually, it’s the NutriBullet, but it’s the big, the blender?
James Larson (30:31.047)
Oh.
James Larson (30:36.974)
Is it a Vitamix or? No, I’m just kidding.
James Larson (30:45.037)
Right.
Kevin R Free (30:45.297)
So he’s making a smoothie, because he’s trying to make me feel guilty for not being on a diet right now.
James Larson (30:49.102)
It’s all good.
James Larson (30:57.69)
It’s a guilt smoothie.
Kevin R Free (31:00.481)
it’s a guilt smoothie because you know I’ve given up basically given up being an actor but I’m still I still think the world revolves around me so of course why would he make a smoothie for his own nutrition it has to be for me that’s to be about me thank you for letting me walk down this little path while he’s blending I’ll go back to my mild square story in a second
James Larson (31:13.73)
Right.
Kevin R Free (31:27.441)
Unless you’re broadcasting this live to the world right now.
James Larson (31:29.934)
This is going live. This is in Times Square right now. Yeah, this is right. This is on the Lion King, you know, the facade. I have connections. Good for us.
Kevin R Free (31:40.462)
Wow, wow, wow. Good for me. Good for you. Good for us. You’re so dry. It’s so funny. Okay. So.
Kevin R Free (31:53.681)
So at Miles Square Theatre, I want us to be focusing on new and gently used plays. Oh, and there it goes again.
James Larson (32:02.307)
It’s really not, I can’t hear it that well, at least. Yeah.
Kevin R Free (32:04.137)
Oh, you can’t? Okay, great, great. Okay, so like I’m really focused on the new plays and the gently used plays, and we’re not begging people from Manhattan to come see our shows, but we are telling playwrights, hey, here’s a place for you to submit your new work because we’re a regional theater and we’re seven minutes from Manhattan. So if you write a play and we produce it and you think that it’s ready for…
James Larson (32:29.091)
True.
Kevin R Free (32:33.517)
commercial production, we are happy to offer industry comps to all the people you’d like to come out to see the play, because it just puts us more on the map when you do that. And so, yeah.
James Larson (32:50.782)
And it’s right there. I mean, it’s an easy sell, as far as a regional theater goes, you know?
Kevin R Free (32:56.157)
Yeah, right. It’s not like anybody has to get on a plane to come see a show at the theater. But I think we’ve made some courageous decisions since I’ve been there, and we are in the process of making some more courageous decisions about programming and presenting work there.
James Larson (32:59.691)
Right.
James Larson (33:20.43)
Is there a certain type of work that the theater… I mean, if you’re a playwright listening, is there a certain type of play you guys look for, or just a good play, or?
Kevin R Free (33:29.657)
Yeah, we look for small cast plays, unfortunately.
James Larson (33:33.258)
which is how big for you? Less than five.
Kevin R Free (33:38.657)
less than five people, five people. So they can be playing a million characters, but we want fewer than five actors in the plays for now. Our contract is the Actors’ Equity Special Appearance Contract, which means we get three equity contracts per production. So that also often includes our resident stage manager.
So, you know, yeah, so there’s that. And then we’re…
Kevin R Free (34:15.741)
Right now, I want comedies. I want, I mean, I don’t mind if those comedies are also about the world, but I love a good comedy. We did the world premiere of a hip hop musical called Quarter Recon in March of 2023. And it was a really, it was a huge success for us. It brought in lots of new audience members.
and was really exciting because it was hip hop. You know, there was a beatboxer on stage who created all of the sounds on stage. It was just really very exciting. And so we’re actively looking for work that will appeal to that audience for next season.
James Larson (34:56.244)
Oh wow.
Kevin R Free (35:14.345)
We think we’re going, at this point, we think we’re going to be producing a world premiere musical, a very small cast musical, which will be the first time, I think, this organization has produced a musical, well, Puerto Rican was the first musical, musical that we produced, I think. And, uh…
James Larson (35:29.366)
Right.
Kevin R Free (35:35.813)
Yeah, a play that is able to, so our mandate is for our creative teams to be half of color, I like to say half of a marginalized community, and we like to be able to cast our plays in the same way. So if you have something to send me that is like that, and it’s funny that we can cast with anybody, that would be great.
What else? I don’t know. I think I’m easy to find. My email address on the website of our theater is our email address, is my email address. So you can reach out to me and say, hey, I have this play. Here are the first 10 pages. And just send it to me and then I’ll read it when I get to it. I’m reading so many things. It’s hard to get to everything, but I’ll read it when I get to it and get back to you when I can.
James Larson (36:16.892)
Right.
Kevin R Free (36:36.529)
Um, I don’t know if I answered that question. Okay, all right. You know, I don’t I never know what I’m going to love. I never know what I’m gonna love and what I’m gonna want. But um, you know next season we’re trying to choose things that have There are kind of recognizable intellectual properties
James Larson (36:39.87)
Yeah, yeah, for sure.
James Larson (37:03.575)
Hmm.
Kevin R Free (37:04.253)
so that we can sell more tickets so that the following season I feel like you know we’ll do like a season of like more obscure titles and then another season that has something that seems a little more recognizable or has like a crazy a crazy title that will hook people in you know and next season we’re looking for more recognizable intellectual projects.
James Larson (37:29.25)
How many shows do you guys produce a year?
Kevin R Free (37:32.385)
four shows and two benefits. And next year we will also be producing or presenting, we think some monthly programs. So, well, I can’t really talk about it actually because no contracts have been signed. But there are New Jersey artists who have their own work that we’d like for the, you know, improv shows and.
magic shows and those sorts of things just to present them in our space. So we’re, so we’re looking for more opportunities like that at this point where we’d like to also in December have a Diwali festival. Um, because we, we want to make sure that we’re inviting the South Asian community of, of Hudson County into our space. Um, yeah, all of those things.
James Larson (38:07.179)
right.
James Larson (38:32.01)
that that’s amazing so that’s kind of cool that you it sounds like it’s kind of flexible like one year you guys do more obscure stuff one you know like are you looking to have a more set season kind of like you know how certain you know theaters have like certain slots that they have like oh we have a musical we have this we have
Kevin R Free (38:47.825)
Yes. So our slots are, our slots are something in the fall, something for Christmas, something in the winter, like March, like right now we have a play that we’re producing right now that opens in a couple weeks, and then, and then another thing in the spring. And one thing is normally children’s play, that we can, you know…
try to book with school groups. And this year, our children’s play may also be our holiday play at the same time. So that we’re combining those things together and increasing the length of the run of the play. So that we can then in the evenings present some of
some like a monthly show or you know a solo play festival of some sort just to just to have a lot of life in the space.
James Larson (39:55.05)
Right. That’s awesome. You know, so my audience that I’m trying to build on this podcast is mostly actors, obviously. And I’m just curious, you know, as someone who’s been on both sides of the table, do you have advice for, especially for, you know, early career actors or people that are thinking of moving to the city or
Kevin R Free (40:07.434)
Mm.
James Larson (40:20.618)
maybe your past self, you know, I mean, do you have any advice that you would give to someone?
Kevin R Free (40:26.405)
Yes, I do. The advice is…
Kevin R Free (40:35.861)
The advice is…
Be- become a member of a community or two or three or four. Like don’t-
Kevin R Free (40:49.713)
or at least be a part of several communities. You know, like if you know of a theater, I mean, My Old Square Theater is the kind of place where you could just decide to see a ticket and come see the show. And we’re such a small organization that we’re accessible, that you can reach out to us and ask us questions and you can come to events and meet us. And…
There are other organizations that are like that. It’s not the same with the Broadway community and it’s not the same with the off-Broadway community. I don’t know where to go for them to just sort of meet people. I don’t know, but there are lots of independent theater outfits in Manhattan. And what I did was I just sort of knew everybody. I just sort of, the show looks interesting. I’m gonna go to the show. And back when the New York International Fringe Festival was a thing, I was there all the time.
James Larson (41:47.809)
Right.
Kevin R Free (41:48.053)
and they always had a lounge where you could hang out. And it just sort of created, just created community among artists. And so I would say become a part of a community or put your face in the place as often as possible. When I was the artistic director of the Fyre This Time Festival, which is a platform for early career playwrights,
Playwrights would reach out to me on LinkedIn all the time and say, hey, I want to write for the Fire This Time Festival. And I would say, have you ever seen any of our shows? And they would say, no. And I would say, okay, well, the first thing you need to do is to come to a show, come to the festival and see what we do and then find me and say hello. I think what the mistake that we all make and I made it was thinking that I was gonna get off the bus from North Carolina and just make a splash.
and just believed that was what, because I was that talented and that people were just gonna see me and they, you know, I’m drinking a malted in a soda shop and all of a sudden I’m a star. And… I’m Rita Hayworth. Isn’t that how she was discovered? But I, you know, I think, but that’s the thing though is that we all believe that we’re that…
James Larson (42:59.739)
What year was this with the malted?
1950s?
Kevin R Free (43:17.365)
that we’re just gonna make a splash, it’s just gonna happen. And I wish that for everyone. I want that to be your story. I would love for you to take Broadway by storm. I would love that. It is not the way it happens all the time. And I love my career. I’ve had a wonderful career. I’m not done yet. I really, really love it. But I have had to work very hard to get what I get.
And so what I would say to young actors is…
Put yourself out there all the time. Do it. Go see shows. See the shows. Go to places where the tickets are less expensive and then find out and then reach out to every.
to every artistic director that you can and just say, hey, I’m around, how do I get to audition for you or what? Or anything. And then recognize when somebody offers you an opportunity that does not pay, that pays you nothing. Recognize that…
Kevin R Free (44:31.697)
Really think about it before you just say absolutely not. Because things have changed, everybody wants to be paid.
Everybody wants to be paid these days, but things haven’t changed enough for theaters to be able to offer pay. And so the, and I’m not telling you to work for free all the time, I’m not saying that at all. That is not what I’m saying. What I’m saying is…
James Larson (44:47.182)
Right.
Kevin R Free (44:58.577)
If a person hears about you or knows about you and offers you a gig that’s like for five days and it pays you nothing, maybe it pays food, think about, Google it. Google the person who offered it. See if there’s somebody that you know who knows them so that they know that, so that you know that they’re not the kind of people who are going to suck your blood and leave you for dead, right? Recognize that.
Kevin R Free (45:29.525)
you’re putting savings in a bank. And there could be a time when you could take those savings out and use them at another time. And also, or that, I know from me, I often ask people to do things because I believe in their talent and recognize and hope and pray that there is another time that I can work with them.
and give them some money when we work together, more than the last time we worked together. I know that that’s the thing that I wanna do. I also don’t have any hard feelings for people who don’t want to work for free at all, because I am one of those people who doesn’t necessarily wanna work for free. But I am doing this podcast, and you are not paying me to do this podcast, because I thought it was important to put my name out there in a way that makes sense. I chose an hour that I was free.
James Larson (45:59.607)
Right.
Kevin R Free (46:25.509)
And I said yes to that. So I think that what we’re not teaching our young people is that we, it’s how to invest in a career.
And I asked you how you knew me. You were like, you keep coming up. And I think I keep coming out because I’m always putting myself out there somehow. And I’m mid-50s and I’ve been around for a long time in the circles of the tri-state area trying to make a career. And I think that the…
I think that people who don’t know me, who look at me and see me working, don’t know the number of emails that I sent out, don’t know the number of times I spoke to my manager today to find out, like, is there, what can we do about this offer that we received, or should I reach out to this publisher or that publisher to see if I can audition for anything that’s coming up? You know, you know, like, I’m still in the trenches trying to make a career.
but it doesn’t happen if you don’t make it happen. And so…
Kevin R Free (47:42.577)
So I, you know, I just say that to say.
Kevin R Free (47:47.973)
before you fight the oppressor, know who the oppressor is. Which is a whole other thing is that, you know, I don’t see myself as the oppressor if I ask you to do a show that I’m doing also. And I’m not getting anything, you know? Anyway, that’s all.
James Larson (48:05.311)
Right.
Right. I think, yeah, I love that. What I tell people is that, I mean, there’s, I thought the same thing. I thought I’m going to get an agent and my agent’s going to make my career and that’s how it’s going to work. I’m like, but now I realize you’re your own agent always. Even if you have an agent and manager, you are your agent.
Kevin R Free (48:27.242)
Yes.
James Larson (48:30.698)
For the rip for your life. I mean, like you said, you know, you’re doing stuff behind the scenes. You’re pitching yourself. You’re sending emails You’re getting involved. You’re going to shows your understanding People you’re meeting people you’re just being a person with other people I mean, that’s how it works. Like people want to work with people that they know like and trust and
And it takes time to develop those relationships. It’s not like you said, you don’t just get off the bus and suddenly you have a career. Like I hope that happens too. But for most people, and it’s more rewarding though to be in the trenches and to, you know, I think people discount the hard work of it, but it’s like it’s also the enjoyable work. I mean.
To me, it’s like theater’s always been about connection with other people. I mean, you’re connecting on stage with another actor. You’re connecting with the audience. The audience is connecting with you. It’s this exchange of energy that you don’t find in any other medium in my experience. And that’s what makes theater have, you know, that’s lasted for millennia. That’s why it’s, it’s an old art form. It’s not like film and TV where it’s a newer art form. It’s like.
There’s a reason that it’s existed for so long. And I think it’s, it’s hard. It’s, it’s like you said, you know, you’re in the trenches and you’re trying to make your career work. And it’s, and I’m the same way. I mean, it’s, uh, it’s a daily task of figuring out what’s next and what’s on the horizon and, and find finding the balance between the artistic side and the business side. You know, is there any.
Where do you find yourself as far as like balancing the business of acting with like the art of it? Like, obviously, you have a lot of roles in that with what everything you do, but like you have an agent and a manager and
Kevin R Free (50:29.621)
Yes, I have a manager and I have a commercial agent, but everything goes through my manager. And we’re now looking for an agent for my directing.
Kevin R Free (50:44.853)
So, I mean, that’s where I find myself. He still submits me for acting jobs. And I, if it’s theater and it’s out of town, I almost always say no to that, to those appointments. Because it’s harder to focus on running Miles Square Theater as an actor than it is as a director when I’m out of town.
James Larson (50:47.399)
Yeah, yeah.
Kevin R Free (51:18.458)
So when you say, where do I find myself there? I mean, yeah, that’s where I am. I mean, with audio books and audio projects in general, they just come to me and then I always add my manager to it. I get a lot of hits on my website and so.
Kevin R Free (51:42.417)
And even there, like somebody offered me something recently to play a part in an audio drama, and I said, no.
because, but it wasn’t because of the salary that they were offering. It was because the salary was not correct. And it was also because I spend as much time on the things that pay less as I do with the things that pay more. So if I were to spend an entire…
James Larson (52:15.501)
Right.
Kevin R Free (52:21.793)
day recording this thing that they wanted me to record, it’s more than a day because I’d have to read it in preparation and then I have to record it and then invariably they’ll say, hey, you mispronounced this word or the tone wasn’t quite right on this. Can you do this again? And there’s not anything, they’re not giving me anything more for my time. And so…
Uhhh…
So, but saying no to that was hard. Because I’m still an actor. I’m still like, oh, you asked me to do something? Of course I wanna do it. I really wanna do it. You know, like, please, oh, you love me? Oh, that’s great, I really wanna do it. But I, so, you know, I talked to my manager and he was like, don’t do it. You can’t do it. You need to make room for the things that you know that you can do and that people will…
people will pay you to do.
Kevin R Free (53:31.457)
And that’s mostly because my voice is a thing. It’s the thing that people pay me the most for. So I have to really kind of, those, I have to be more choosy about that kind of stuff. Only audiobooks and audio drama. I don’t do voiceovers.
James Larson (53:47.074)
How did you get involved? So what kind of voiceover stuff do you do mostly? Hmm.
James Larson (53:57.175)
Okay.
Kevin R Free (53:58.917)
I wish I did voiceovers because they pay so well. The difference between the two is that with a voiceover is you spend like a half hour in a studio for a radio spot or a television commercial or something and make hundreds of thousands of dollars. And for audiobooks, audiobooks are like the theater of the voiceover world.
You work really hard on them and you do get paid well, but you don’t get residuals and you don’t, it’s a lot more work. It’s done the same amount of work. For a 15 second commercial, I get paid the same amount of money. Yes. That’s exactly it. So that, so, you know, and I do audio dramas too. I’m the voice of Kevin on Welcome to Night Vale. And…
James Larson (54:34.802)
a lot more work. It’s instead of saying one line for 15 seconds commercial and getting paid the same as an audiobook, you do an entire audiobook.
Kevin R Free (54:57.761)
And I am, right now I have a, there’s an audio drama out called Ask Your Father that I play a role, I play artificial intelligence in that. So yeah, I mean, I think I’m, in the voiceover world, in the commercial voiceover world, you’re not necessarily an actor, you’re just a voice. You know, with the personality, with the personality that a producer is looking for. And so…
with the work that I do with my voice.
it’s still acting. I still have to prepare and I still have to figure all of that out. So it scratches the acting itch for me and it’s plenty. And I don’t have to leave home.
James Larson (55:48.386)
Is there any, do you have any tips on getting into that kind of work? Because obviously a lot of actors during the pandemic kind of, you know, were more interested in it because that’s the only kind of work that was sort of available for a while.
Kevin R Free (56:02.053)
Yeah. The advice I can give is there are, so the Amazon has a self-publishing arm called ACX. So if you go to acx.com and create a profile there, they’ll also show you exactly how to build your own studio at home. But if you record samples of your voice and upload them there, then you can also submit yourself for work.
And when you want to do an audio book demo, it’s basically, um, you need to do like three minute samples. Hold on one second. Do you need me? Oh, okay. Um, three minute samples from, you know, books that you like and you upload those. There are people, if you, if, if you are a member of that very old platform,
couple of groups where you can join and they’ll they also help you do put up put together a studio that kind of thing. As for how to get a job, gosh, ACX is like the self-publishing thing is really the easiest way they do and they’ll pay you
different ways. There’s a royalty share or they’ll pay you an hourly. And I would say for your first book, do a royalty share so that you can get an idea. It pays good money. You’re not going to get a lot of money, but you are definitely going to get the experience and then you will be able to say to yourself, oh, this is an experience that I like. This is an experience that I want to do. This is the experience because the experience of doing audiobooks is not fun and games. It is often you’re sitting in a studio
this little room that I’m in right now for four to five hours. Um, and those are, those are short days. That’s a short day. Um, and so I would say to do royalty share it, see if you like that. And then once you’ve done the royalty share, then you have a sample of a book that you’ve already recorded. You can use that as your, as one of your demos, like, and you slowly replace the little demos that you made on your own and in your closet or whatnot. Um,
James Larson (58:03.692)
Right.
Kevin R Free (58:28.661)
And then you just build from there. But I will say also that, again, have a healthy relationship with failure because we don’t ever get the thing that we got on the first try, the thing that we’re doing on the first try. It’s never, that’s just not how it works. So you might be…
A friend of mine just started doing audiobooks and I had been referring her to people who employed me for 15 years. And during the pandemic, she finally got in and now is, you know, not a full-time narrator, but she supplements her income pretty well with it. So 15 years, 15 years I’d been trying to get her in. So you know, it’s it is.
It is definitely worth a shot. But it is a long game, just like a career. Every career is a long game.
James Larson (59:25.462)
It’s a long game though, for sure.
James Larson (59:30.57)
Right. Sometimes I think about, you know, there’s so many like, everyone’s about the side hustle now, necessarily for most people. I mean, my thing is even Ryan Reynolds has companies like he’s not just acting like at all levels of the industry, people have multiple things that they do. And that’s, that’s the norm. And that’s not necessarily a bad thing, but sometimes it can all feel like a hustle, you know, like you’re auditioning for audio books, you’re auditioning for.
regular, you know, theater or film or TV or whatever. And I’ve found that I need something not stable, but that I need something that I can hang my hat on that I have more control over. And I found that through writing, like I’ve recently kind of what you said about when you decided to say you’re a director.
Kevin R Free (01:00:15.165)
Yes.
James Larson (01:00:24.254)
Like when you kind of own that identity, I guess that was a part of you. That’s kind of what I’ve recently found. And I know you’re a writer as well, right?
Kevin R Free (01:00:33.693)
Yeah, yeah, I mean, such as it is, yes.
James Larson (01:00:38.618)
So I’m kind of I try and tell people to just And I got this advice from another actor a long time ago But he said you know have something outside the industry that is of interest to you and maybe it’s a relationship That’s that’s a foundation for you or your family or a hobby or an interest or something like Like you said don’t just be all about the work like be a person and enrich yourself as a person
you know, because it all it all feeds into it. Speaking of that, do you in your offstage life? I’m curious what your interests or hobbies might be.
Kevin R Free (01:01:15.897)
Yeah, um, I don’t… So Before I started doing audiobooks, I was an avid reader
So when I became an audiobook narrator and the work started to pop off, I stopped reading for pleasure because every time I picked up a book for pleasure, I had to put it down because I had to prep an audiobook. So, and I just sort of, and I sort of just really hoped and prayed that I would start doing books that were even, that were more interesting to me. And I’m finally at that place where all of the reading that I do for audiobooks is super interesting to me. So that part is great.
So that said, when I read for pleasure, I read articles about theater and no lie, recipes. I love reading recipes. I love especially the recipes that I’m never gonna be able to tackle at home. So like I’m a cook and I love to cook and it’s one of my favorite things. I actually just started a project, a cooking project that…
James Larson (01:02:14.599)
Really?
Kevin R Free (01:02:23.633)
So Bon Appetit released their 56, they were like 56, either their favorite recipes of 2023, hold on.
It’s, um, ah, it’s, uh.
every recipe from the bone app a t 56 is what the link is. So the bone app a t 56 I have no idea why it’s called the bone app t 56. But I have and that’s basically a recipe per week for a year.
And so I just decided that I was going to start doing that, doing this list of recipes. Yeah. Um, you know, there’s some of them I’ll do, but won’t eat. Like there’s the, there’s like a, like I should, things that I shouldn’t have, like the giant panna cotta.
James Larson (01:03:14.097)
like once a week kind of thing or?
That’s cool.
Kevin R Free (01:03:32.813)
And as I look at this list, I think, oh, I’ve done this. I mean, I probably won’t make the lamb quema tacos. I’ll make them, but I won’t make them with lamb. I mean, I could, I like lamb. Anyhow, I just. Which one? I mean, come on, right? Right, so like, I think I’m gonna be doing a lot of.
James Larson (01:03:51.165)
Tater Tot Tortilla Espanola. That sounds amazing actually.
Kevin R Free (01:04:00.641)
these recipes and I love, so I love to cook. And that is, it really kind of sustains me. It feels kind of both creative and also a challenge and not a thing that makes me, if I fail, it doesn’t make me feel like I’m a terrible person. Ha ha.
Kevin R Free (01:04:26.55)
I mean, in general, I’m good with failure, but I’m not. I love food. So I feel like if I know what I put into it, I know that I’m not going to hate it, even if I would never serve it to anybody else. So when I cook anything, it still feels like I accomplished something because I get to nourish myself. That’s right.
James Larson (01:04:46.742)
Yeah, I mean, you have to eat. So it’s a good, that’s a good interest to have. I wish I had, I wish I shared that interest. Because that’s one of the things I wish I would have learned like earlier, like how to cook at least like basic dishes. I mean, it’s hard.
Kevin R Free (01:04:52.573)
I wish I shared that in the chat.
Kevin R Free (01:05:03.529)
Dude, wait, you’re in your 30s, right? That’s when I started cooking. Yeah, yeah, I was, I, you really, listen, people like to talk a lot of shit about Rachael Ray, but I was on an airplane, I was on a jet blue flight when I was like 32, 33 years old, and her show, 30 Minute Meals, came on, and I was watching, I was like, who is this cuckoo? And…
James Larson (01:05:06.666)
Yeah, I can cook. Really? Is it okay? Okay.
James Larson (01:05:29.118)
on the plane?
Kevin R Free (01:05:30.577)
on the plane and I was just watching her cook and I found myself really loving watching her cook and loving hearing her talking about cooking and the fact that she wasn’t a chef was really interesting to me. And then, I mean, the next thing I knew, I bought like some pans that were branded with her name and her 30-minute meal cookbooks and I started cooking her simple 30-minute meals for myself and watching her as I cooked. And so that became…
That’s how I learned how to cook. Um, the older I get, the, you know, the more I want to try some complicated things. Um, and because I’m me, I don’t have, like the only go-to meals that I have are eggs. Boiled or scrambled. And, oh, and avocado toast. Those are like go-to things for me.
James Larson (01:06:20.034)
Hey, a good egg, you can’t argue with a good egg, you know?
Kevin R Free (01:06:28.105)
But generally speaking, I like to try new things when I’m cooking and like I make things like, oh, this is really great, I’m gonna make this again. And then I.
James Larson (01:06:38.32)
Do you meal prep or do you daily cook?
Kevin R Free (01:06:41.546)
Um, daily cook most of the time.
When I go out of town to do a show, like when I was in Portland doing the play that goes wrong.
The first two weeks I knew what I was going to be cooking while I was there because I knew I was gonna be extra busy. So I did meal prep at the beginning of each week to be ready to cook the stuff. But that’s not necessarily, that’s not always.
The prep sometimes is a part of the unwinding.
Kevin R Free (01:07:21.697)
day. Grabbing the onions and the garlic and chopping that up and getting it ready to cook is often just part of getting it ready. And often when I’m cooking, I read the recipe like 10 times before I even begin.
James Larson (01:07:22.764)
right.
Kevin R Free (01:07:46.213)
It’s obsessive. But I’ll read it like 10 times before I begin cooking because I’m thinking about like, what can I, how can I, it’s funny, my husband always makes fun of me. He’s like, are you following the recipe? Are you wildcatting? Like, what are you, you know? But I’m like, and sometimes I’m following the recipe, but other times I think, you know, I can cook the chicken. So like yesterday I did the first meal that I was gonna try.
James Larson (01:07:46.873)
That’s so funny. Yeah, that is a little obsessive.
James Larson (01:08:03.543)
Wildcatting.
Kevin R Free (01:08:15.521)
It’s called the halal cart chicken salad.
And so the chicken is supposed to be a rotisserie chicken, and there are pita chips on the salad, and it’s supposed to be like, you know, bagged pita chips. But I was like, I’m gonna, I’m gonna bake my own pita chips. I’m gonna figure that out. So I got pita bread and I cut it up and I made pita chips and they’re, it’s really good. They’re really good chips. And then for the chicken, I didn’t have a rotisserie chicken because I have chicken breasts in the freezer. So I thawed it and I…
cook the chicken, but I was thinking like, what can I do in advance before I’m cooking, before I eat, so I can get this done? So, and that’s often why I will read the recipe like 10 times, because I need to think, I wanna think about like managing my time. How am I gonna do this and then what am I gonna, so I’ll chop this first, you know, and I know myself well enough to know that I’m not like the fat, I don’t chop like.
fast like the people on TV. So I know that it all has to be prepped before I put anything in the pan. So I’m not gonna like chop as I go. Like you watch those people chopping and throwing them in the pan and chopping and throwing. Like it makes me too nervous. Yes. Yeah, that’s exactly it. Yes, yes. And so I do that. I do that first.
James Larson (01:09:37.39)
Is it mise en place or where you like get everything ready at the beginning? Yeah.
Kevin R Free (01:09:48.919)
I feel like.
James Larson (01:09:48.926)
Isn’t it stressful though to get like to make dishes and then be like, I have to make, I have to clean these dishes and that’s the part that gets me, I guess.
Kevin R Free (01:09:54.621)
No. I was raised washing dishes by hand. We had a dishwasher my whole life and my father was like, you were washing dishes. Never, we never used it. It was his way of, it was his way of, I guess, teaching us discipline. He was like, you know, what if you get a job as a dishwasher somewhere? I was like, I’m not gonna get a job as a dishwasher. I’m not gonna do that.
James Larson (01:10:03.946)
He never used it.
James Larson (01:10:18.41)
Maybe that’s it. One of my first jobs was as a dishwasher at my college. So maybe that’s why. And now I don’t have one being in New York. Not a lot of people have them, so.
Kevin R Free (01:10:24.554)
Aha. See?
Kevin R Free (01:10:29.701)
Yeah, no, I love washing dishes. I actually, I hated it when I was a kid, but I really love washing dishes now. So, you know, my husband is really good when he cooks. He’s really good at washing things as he goes. And I’m good at first. And then after a while I’m like, eh, I’ll tackle it later. And what I think I love most of all is like doing something.
a one pot meal or like a one sheet pan meal so that there’s so that when the when the pot is finally on the stove and it’s cooking for like the next 45 minutes I can spend that time drinking wine and washing dishes. So
James Larson (01:11:18.426)
Liners have changed my life because I have this Liners for her like an air fryer. So I just put there’s like a parchment paper liner and I love that and then I have a liner for the What is it the slow cooker which is great
Kevin R Free (01:11:26.108)
Yes.
Kevin R Free (01:11:34.625)
Oh, yeah, for your instant pot or the, yeah. Yeah, yeah. So I’m so, I’m so happy for you. Last week, I made this really good, um, lentil soup with sausage and spinach. In my instant pot. It was, I used, I don’t use the instant pot for like.
James Larson (01:11:38.602)
Just a plain old slow cooker, yeah. It works, it works, it helps. Thank you. Liners.
Kevin R Free (01:12:02.465)
pressure cooking or anything like that. I just use it for, as a slow cooker all the time. And this soup was ridonkulous. I mean, it was so good. I can’t even, I can’t.
James Larson (01:12:16.27)
Was it from the Bon Appetit 56 or was it a different? Okay.
Kevin R Free (01:12:19.025)
It was not. It was not, but I think it was a Bon Appetit recipe. Hold on. Hold on. No, actually it’s a New York Times cooking recipe.
James Larson (01:12:30.422)
Oh, I love the New York Times. I found a coconut curry recipe that’s like, or a coconut chickpea curry recipe that I’ve made many times and it’s super good.
Kevin R Free (01:12:39.809)
Yes, yes. So, those, the emails that they send every day, I read, I read those emails from, I read them. I mean, I read them. I read them and I click the links on them. Today’s recipe of the day is a lasagna soup, which seems, it’s like a deconstructed lasagna, which seems
James Larson (01:12:51.182)
You read the emails?
Kevin R Free (01:13:07.165)
super interesting. There’s also in the same email a miso mushroom barley soup, which we were both, which my husband and I were just looking at thinking, hey, let’s make that. Food is amazing, James.
James Larson (01:13:08.472)
Yeah.
James Larson (01:13:19.298)
Me says amazing.
James Larson (01:13:23.522)
food is amazing. I love the detour that we’ve taken this amazing. But it’s
Kevin R Free (01:13:28.381)
I mean, I feel like I’m most passionate about things that I’m not. And there’s no pressure. I’m more most passionate about cooking meals and less passionate about my work work.
James Larson (01:13:34.771)
Exactly.
James Larson (01:13:40.718)
but it does have to do with acting because like, maybe, you know, I lived in some not great apartments and like having to figure out how to cook is like, you know, you wanna, especially if you’re an early career actor, you probably wanna save money and cooking’s the way to do that, you know? And I wish I was a better example of that, but we all gotta eat, right, so.
Kevin R Free (01:13:56.771)
Yeah.
Kevin R Free (01:14:03.037)
Yes, you’re a work in progress. It seems like you cook enough. You make the chickpea curry. And there was another one that you mentioned.
James Larson (01:14:08.978)
Yeah, yeah, because you know what one of the why because it’s all it’s like mostly from canned ingredients this canned pumpkin cans chickpeas canned So it’s like easy to have as a pantry you can have basically all of it as a pantry But it still tastes really fresh together. That’s what I love But the one the one pot stuff i’m totally down with like that’s amazing
Kevin R Free (01:14:24.169)
Yeah, yeah, yes.
Kevin R Free (01:14:31.401)
And I think you should continue down that road. Don’t be afraid of it. Allow that to happen. That’s good. It’s good. Although I have to say my pita chips today, really good. I made another batch because I ate them all yesterday. Well, you take it, you know, if you get just a get pita bread at the grocery store and if you have…
James Larson (01:14:38.934)
Maybe, yeah, okay. That’s amazing.
James Larson (01:14:47.658)
Yeah. You make them fresh? How do you make fresh pita?
Kevin R Free (01:14:59.713)
Kitchen shears.
Kevin R Free (01:15:03.901)
You cut like, because they’re pockets basically, you know, you can open the pita and you can, so you cut them around the edge. So you basically have two round pieces of pita. So I did that with two of the pita pockets. And then I put olive oil on, I like made sure that they were covered with olive oil, then seaweed salt and
I use za’atar seasoning on them. So make sure that they’re covered both sides with olive oil and then you put the salt on there and then you cut them into little triangles, spread them out evenly on a pan, but you cannot use parchment paper.
I know, I’m so sorry to say this to you. I know, I’m so sorry that I had to tell you this. No, no. I mean, maybe foil would be fine, but maybe foil would be fine actually because it’s another metal surface. But put it, so if you use aluminum foil, make sure it’s super flat on the thing. And I would also say.
James Larson (01:15:54.702)
I told you about my liners.
James Larson (01:15:59.261)
foil, aluminum foil? What?
Kevin R Free (01:16:23.593)
it might be a good idea to heat the pan with the olive oil first. Or not the olive oil, heat the pan with the aluminum foil first. Out of the oven and then put the pita chips all in one layer on the pan. Just because of the two layers of the aluminum foil, that the heat has to go through the pan and the aluminum foil.
So you want them to be directly onto a metal surface. And I think it would take too long to get the aluminum foil hot enough to make the chips as crisp as you need them to be. So like you, so you put to the, I just, I’m 425 in the oven for seven minutes. Take them out, it doesn’t matter whether you think that they’re crispy enough or not. Seven minutes is all they can bear. Do it.
James Larson (01:17:01.245)
be.
Kevin R Free (01:17:18.593)
because yesterday I did 10 minutes and they were a little too dark. Anyhow, pull them out of the oven and just leave them on the pan. Let them cool on the pan and they get nice and crispy. Put them in Tupperware. Eat the shit out of them.
James Larson (01:17:34.286)
Chef Kevin. I love it.
Kevin R Free (01:17:36.77)
Hahaha
James Larson (01:17:40.127)
Ugh.
Kevin R Free (01:17:42.345)
You had no idea. You had no idea this was.
James Larson (01:17:43.786)
I had no idea. Rachel, Rachel Ray, man. I got it. I didn’t know she wasn’t a chef. I thought so. She was so her thing is like she’s not a trained chef or something.
Kevin R Free (01:17:47.758)
I know! Listen, say what you want!
Kevin R Free (01:17:54.054)
Yeah, she’s just a home cook. She just likes to cook.
Yeah, I’m pretty sure she’s not a chef. I mean, I don’t know. After a while, I felt, she fell out of favor with me. But I am super grateful that I saw her on that JetBlue flight and thought, oh, I can do this, I can do this, I’m gonna do this and started cooking, you know?
James Larson (01:18:26.318)
Maybe this is my origin story for cooking.
Kevin R Free (01:18:33.961)
Um, how dare you, sir?
James Larson (01:18:34.162)
Um, Kevin are free. Thank you so much for joining me on the podcast today. And thanks everyone for listening. Is there any place to connect with you that you prefer?
Kevin R Free (01:18:49.349)
Um, you can go to my website, www.kevinarfree.com. If you want to audition at Mile Square Theater for anything, go to my email address there is krfree at mile, M-I-L-E square S-Q-U-A-R-E theater, T-E theater, T-H-E-A-T-R-E.org.
Kevin R Free (01:19:19.849)
That. All of that.
James Larson (01:19:25.227)
Nailed it. That was amazing.
Kevin R Free (01:19:26.277)
Nailed it. I mean, you know, I think if you google me you can find me and I’m happy to respond I’m happy to for you to reach out and Get in touch
James Larson (01:19:29.91)
Yeah.
James Larson (01:19:39.87)
Well, thanks so much. I learned a lot and I had a good time chatting so I hope you did as well and Awesome. Alrighty
Kevin R Free (01:19:45.321)
Great. Same. I did. All right. I will talk to you.
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